|
Post by Ethan / JRyan on Aug 18, 2018 14:56:54 GMT -5
The more I read the latest PR, the more something is not right. I do not mean the difficulties with the drilling but the 'meat' of the picture we are facing.
The more it makes no sense. Please correct me where I am wrong but I had thought the deepest zone was already tested and they have moved up to the 3000 m part, you know right below the cap rock! This makes no sense with were we thought we were testing.
Some thoughts, with the SEC there, and the rumbling they had to release something and they did and it was not good, at least what I can see.
However something is bugging me real bad. Its Genie again. This seems like groundhog day or something. Is this a way to take attention away from it? I just do not know. Oct 11, 2015 1:51 PM www.haaretz.com/israel-news/business/.premium-genie-confirms-report-of-possible-big-golan-oil-find-1.5407615 U.S. company says it found ‘significant’ qualities of oil and gas at Ness licenseAnd I quote : Huge Oil Discovery on the Golan Heights! mjaa.org/huge-oil-discovery-on-the-golan-heights/Is There Really More Oil in The Golan Heights than in Saudi Arabia? Who’s Genie Energy? www.armstrongeconomics.com/international-news/middle_east/is-there-really-more-oil-in-the-golan-heights-than-is-saudi-arabia/That is pretty darn exciting is it not? But wait.... GENIE OIL: THE SYRIA, GOLDMAN SACHS, ISRAEL, ISIS CONNECTION www.trunews.com/article/genie-oil-the-syria-goldman-sachs-israel-isis-connectionLook at the group in charge at the bottom. Recognize any of the names? Strategic Advisory Board genieoilgas.com/about-us/strategic-advisory-board/All that to this!!! NEWARK, N.J., Nov. 16, 2017 Genie Energy Suspends Exploratory Oil and Gas Drilling Program in Northern Israel www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/genie-energy-suspends-exploratory-oil-and-gas-drilling-program-in-northern-israel-300558113.htmlI hate to say this but something doesn't pass the smell test. How can they just say "oops, we made a mistake, there is no oil"
Does anyone else have any comments or thoughts about this?Updated: Quick RECAPAnd here it is! I have been looking for this for DAYS!!!NEWARK, N.J., May 3, 2018FINANCIAL AND OPERATIONAL HIGHLIGHTS Genie Energy Ltd. Reports First Quarter 2018 Results
|
|
|
Post by Ethan / JRyan on Aug 20, 2018 21:41:02 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by Ethan / JRyan on Aug 20, 2018 21:52:17 GMT -5
I am sure there is nothing to it really, I mean they are TOO far apart, right?
|
|
|
Post by Ethan / JRyan on Aug 20, 2018 22:01:24 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by Ethan / JRyan on Aug 21, 2018 21:48:57 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by Ethan / JRyan on Aug 21, 2018 21:53:30 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by Ethan / JRyan on Aug 21, 2018 21:57:41 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by Ethan / JRyan on Aug 21, 2018 22:05:05 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by Ethan / JRyan on Aug 21, 2018 22:15:37 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by Ethan / JRyan on Aug 24, 2018 17:33:29 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by Ethan / JRyan on Aug 24, 2018 17:48:19 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by Ethan / JRyan on Aug 24, 2018 19:39:53 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by Ethan / JRyan on Aug 24, 2018 19:51:53 GMT -5
Questions from a concerned 11 year Stockholder.
With the latest PR out and asking for more funds to test MJ#1, I have come across some information that has me concerned.
I have been following this well MJ#1 a lot as you well know but I was not real thrilled with what I learned with the last 2 updates but not for the reasons you think. We are still testing the Triassic. This came as a shock to me to say the least as I had thought we had moved on to the Jurassic and its HTHP characteristics.
I have been researching the search for oil in Israel a lot the last 2 weeks and I have stumbled onto something that is a very large concern to me. I know that the Zion scientific team is well aware of what I am talking about.
First, Givot hit a productive well, Meged-5, I believe. What I do not know is if they had to frac it to get the flow that they had. They produced over 1 million barrels before it ran out in a short time. That is a characteristic of a fracked well system or so I have read. Of course they ran out of funds and along with other issues are no longer are producing oil for sale. However we know Israel HAS oil, that is FACT. What is unknown is how much.
This led me to the Genie discovery on the Golan Heights. Sure they had a huge announcement in 2015 that they had the potential of Billions of barrels. “We are talking about a [stratum] which is 350 meters thick, and what is important is the thickness and the porosity. On average in the world, strata are 20-30 meters thick, so this is ten times as large as that, so we are talking about significant quantities. The important thing is to know the oil is in the rock and that’s what we now know,” Israel business website Globes quotes Yuval Bartov, chief geologist of Afek Oil and Gas as saying. Afek is a subsidiary of the America’s Genie Energy.” Huge Oil Discovery on the Golan Heights!Last month Afek, an Israeli subsidiary of Genie Energy, a US oil company, announced that it had found considerable reserves of oil under the Golan. Genie’s chief geologist in Israel, Yuval Bartov, said the company believed the reservoir had the “potential of billions of barrels”. Israel Stakes Claim to Golan After Oil Find"Yes. This is one of the best kept secrets. You can imagine that if this went into production, then the disputed Syrian land issue occupied by Israel would come to the forefront. This is why it gets no play but this is one reason Obama was working to overthrow the Syrian government. They would not have political people on the Strategic Advisory Board if they did not need political strings pulled.” Is There Really More Oil in The Golan Heights than in Saudi Arabia? Who’s Genie Energy?That is a B for billion, and therefore a game changer. That is until this: NEWARK, N.J., Nov. 16, 2017
Genie Energy Suspends Exploratory Oil and Gas Drilling Program in Northern Israel
Afek, the subsidiary of Genie Energy Ltd. (NYSE: GNE, GNEPRA) conducting an oil and gas exploratory program in Northern Israel, today announced that preliminary analysis of results from its completed Ness 10 exploratory well in Northern Israel suggests that the well's target zone does not contain commercially producible quantities of oil or natural gas. Genie Energy Suspends Exploratory Oil and Gas Drilling Program in Northern IsraelAnd just like that, they are out. Well I figured it was a geopolitical game of some sorts but I was not overly concerned until I ran into this article: Although the company reports finding evidence of hydrocarbons and/or gas in all the sites drilled so far (some in the form of liquid oil), the presence of water and the low permeability in the hydrocarbon and gas carrying strata made it difficult to extract viable amounts of liquid oil and gas under current permit restrictions. Reviewing its data, Afek has already announced that it does not plan to resume actual drilling before the Q4 2016, Q1 2017. The Israeli public says no to fracking
As seen blow we are drilling in the same formation, the Palmyra rift system, and the ‘oil’ finds are all in the Triassic which is where we are testing at present.
I do not want to get into politics at all even though I think it is a factor of some sorts. I would like to ask a direct question from Zion Oil. “Is the portion of the Triassic that we are presently testing similar in nature to what both Givot & Genie found with their drilling programs? I mean is the presence of water and low permeability a sign of these zones of interest we have found in the Triassic? It is ok if they are but it that begs the question, is it within Zion Oil’s mandate from the Israeli petroleum industry to frac the Triassic in an attempt to recover commercial oil? Has this been taken off the table by either environmental concerns or politics? The reason this is a concern is that I have been guessing at what sort of profit Zion would make on every barrel of oil they could produce. Using conservative figures, I had it at around $10-15 a barrel with Brent at $70. If fracking is the only way to get the oil, that quickly becomes uneconomical as it costs $30-35 over a conventional field to get oil by fracking in the Bakken and that does not have near the environmental rules of Israel, let alone the logistics involved in getting that type of specialized equipment to Israel even if they would allow it. It is important for me to know these type of details if I am to take part in a DSP program. I have had over 1000 warrants expire so I am a bit gun-shy at this point. I poured what powder I was willing to risk into MJ#1, and I am extremely cautious about doing it again with no information to go on. I am Pro Zion Oil as you know but I am also very cautious as there is not a lot of information flowing out from Zion these days. We are being attacked as a company. I have defended this company much the last few months with a vigor I am sure y’all are aware of. I have been on the Yahoo message boards and IHub in the thick of it as I have told IR before and I am doing what I can to defend her, but Zion has to give us something to defend her with. Thank you for at least addressing the SEC question publicly. I am not super concerned with this as I believe I know how it got started but that is not for this email. I would suggest weekly updates but I do not know if that is possible but 2 months between them is not acceptable, at least in my eyes. Every other week would be good enough. In summation, I have called in a few times and spoken with IR about many of things but they cannot nor should they answer these type questions. So I am asking for at least an answer to the issue that I think I have found with the Triassic, which is where we are still presently testing. I look forward to a reasonably detailed reply. Sincerely, Ethan PS I have created a place where Zion longs can discuss our stock without all the distractions of the active stock shorters & manipulators. I have already informed Zion Oil of this as well as my defense of her on Yahoo Message boards and the iHub. christians4zionoil.freeforums.net/forum************************************************************************************** ************************************************************************************** ************************************************************************************** ************************************************************************************** ************************************************************************************** I SENT BACK MY REPLY IN BoldI read your email and believe I understand your concerns.
At present, nothing has been taken off the table.
However, these questions are near impossible to answer at this point. Not necessarily due material informational reasons either.
Without getting into the scientific details, these are questions we have to face and answer when we get there and would be unproductive answering them at this juncture. Thank you for the reply. One thing I have learned is that I need to better understand the term 'fracking'. I guess the details are important in regards to what is considered fracking as we Americans think of it. I am ignorant of the technologies at play and I will do what I can to better understand it so I can better frame my original question.The focus at this point is to get complete clarity of the well we have drilled. The clarity and understanding will lead us to either the necessary options to allow this well to be commercially viable or to see that all options mean it is not commercially viable. Either way will lead to a number of other options.That makes sense, in short, we need time to see exactly what MJ#1 has found. What we do know is that it is not a gusher and even though we all want it to be, the facts show that it is not. What is neat, is that we do have an active petroleum system, the oil is there. It is the amount that is the big question and how much it would cost to get it to the surface. My estimate of $30+ a barrel for non-conventional means in Israel is just that, and estimate.I can tell you that executive management and our geoscientists are still optimistic but tempered due to the difficulty.As are the shareholders for much the same reasons I would think.All of the above is merely my words interpreting the recent PRs, by the way. That may be frustrating since there’s nothing new, but perhaps an angle to help you understand a few things in light of your questions. It does just that. IR is kept in the dark about the technical things as that would normal for this type of situation, it proprietary information. I do understand and for the most part agree. I just think we shareholders can no longer be kept in the dark along with you!!My understanding that the Triassic layer across the Palmyra right system area varies in much the same way as the current surface varies. So, it’s not easy or even correct to make the correlation where Givot and Afek were drilling. Also, my understanding is that Afek had a rather shallow drilling depth and was drilling into the source rock itself.Interesting, I did not consider that, I had thought that Genie was drilling deep (16k ft) also.You are correct, I found it,""Atid will bring together an experienced operations team, international partners who will provide additional technical expertise in the planning and execution of projects, and a high capability drilling rig based in Israel and equipped to operate at depths up to 2,000 m," Rochwarger concluded." 2000 m = ~6500 feetGenie Energy launches drilling services company in IsraelIt would seem with research that there was a great variability in the areas drilled just as you said and now it makes sense. I have been reading a lot on what Givot found and what characteristics their wells had. Disclaimer : I own Givot Stock (small amount)Givot did not Frac the well in the sense that we understand the current massive frac operations in Texas and N Dakota. In another sense, we have a number of smaller fracking process options that Givot may have (and likely) employed. I’m not sure on that.Once again you are correct, not fracking as I thought it was but more a horizontal drilling with some 'simulation' techniques"Development likely will start with the horizontal completion of existing wells, Luskin said. It is unclear whether gas will be reinjected or sold locally.Consultants said production profiles suggest that a single 1,000-m drain hole would have initial production of 900 b/d of oil and average 476 b/d the first year, declining to a stable 200 b/d during 7 years' production.Two horizontal legs from the same vertical well will double these rates and drain about 5 sq km." 07/05/2004ISRAEL'S FIRST SUBSTANTIAL ONSHORE OIL FIND NEEDS HORIZONTAL WELLS FOR DEVELOPMENTOne of the aspects of the oil industry that I did not know until speaking with those in the industry is that fracking has been used since the 1950s and the ability and the technology has expanded. So, the “massive fracking” plays currently happening are in areas where there is a lot of data and will employ horizontal aspects to access more of the formation. The main key is that they have a lot of data in the particular areas they are fracking to know exactly the type of results they will get.That I assume would be tough to get permission from Israel for let alone the funds. However Zion does have a good relationship with the Israeli Petroleum commission. It can not be ruled out I presume.This is not the case with a wildcat well. The key aspect right now is understanding. And, Zion may have much more than what I know or can say, but we are in the place of carefully and painstakingly understanding what is there. And, from that, we can plan on the best next steps.I understand completely and I want to thank you for answering my questions as best you could. I have much more research to do to not only understand just where we are drilling and why but also to gather the understanding of time and how precious it is to make the right decisions off accurate and reliable information.We believe we will succeed and know that our God is big to provide a way at the moment we need it.If it be His will then it will happen, of this I am sure. I believe we will succeed as well, that is why I invested in 2007 and have been accumulating ever since.Based on the sentence above, we understand your hesitancy and please only add to your investment if your criteria is met to do so on a high-risk investment such as wildcat drilling.I fully understand and I will continue to research and learn. That is the key for me. In closing, remember we shareholders are out there and desire to know what is going on with our well. Transparency will be rewarded so I ask for more frequent updates, even if only minor as they help with the wanting to play an active part in not only MJ#1 but in Zion's Mission in general. Thanks again for your time.
Shalom,
But By Grace Alone Go I...
Ethan My questions were about Genie, Givot, and the Palmyra Formations. What I learned was I have more reading to do.
|
|
ryan
Believer
Posts: 6
|
Post by ryan on Aug 24, 2018 21:24:30 GMT -5
Ethan, do most of your concerns relate to the Triassic? If so what about the Jurassic? It seems to me there is a lot more potential there. Do you also think the IR responses pertain purely to the Triassic and not the complete well?
Just seems like we are so focused on the Triassic but we may be overlooking the greater potential in the Jurassic. Wish we’d quickly get the data needed and move on to the Jurassic.
|
|
|
Post by Ethan / JRyan on Aug 24, 2018 21:55:09 GMT -5
Ryan - no this email was specifically about the Triassic, where we are testing.
The Jurassic testing will come when done with the Triassic as to go back down and test is not ideal or it might not even be possible.
The Target was the Triassic and they even had a amendment to the drilling plan to go deeper, I think it was like 200m more and they only went 100m or so. I would have to go back and read that right PR. In essence, this was the MAIN target of MJ#1.
We will know what is up with the Jurassic in due time I guess. My worry was about what we had encountered in the Triassic and it permeability and ability to release oil. IR can not tell us some things but it did answer my questions about the Genie for sure. That is totally different strata.
I will read more this weekend.
|
|
ryan
Believer
Posts: 6
|
Post by ryan on Aug 24, 2018 22:22:49 GMT -5
Ethan,
I talked with IR today. He noted they had some surprises higher in the well. He didn’t say specifically the Jurassic or higher up. But he kind of implied they are very interested in the higher zones, but as you noted, they needed to test the well from the bottom up. It seems to me their initial goal was deep in the Triassic. But now have more interest in the higher areas, just need to due dilegence in the Triassic and move on. He noted what they will do next will have some dependency on funding. I asked him for pressure and temp data in the Jurassic, but he didn’t have. I hope they provide some well/wire log info from their next zones of interest to give us investors a little more meat to chew on and encourage us to keep hanging in there.
|
|
|
Post by Ethan / JRyan on Aug 24, 2018 22:47:57 GMT -5
Ethan, I talked with IR today. He noted they had some surprises higher in the well. He didn’t say specifically the Jurassic or higher up. But he kind of implied they are very interested in the higher zones, but as you noted, they needed to test the well from the bottom up. It seems to me their initial goal was deep in the Triassic. But now have more interest in the higher areas, just need to due dilegence in the Triassic and move on. He noted what they will do next will have some dependency on funding. I asked him for pressure and temp data in the Jurassic, but he didn’t have. I hope they provide some well/wire log info from their next zones of interest to give us investors a little more meat to chew on and encourage us to keep hanging in there. I would hope so also. The Jurassic is where the HTHP and new BOP and of course 42 day delay came from. I am adding information that might help others understand from previous posts on the Hub.
|
|
|
Post by Ethan / JRyan on Aug 25, 2018 8:16:36 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by WILDCAT KEVIN on Aug 25, 2018 16:35:55 GMT -5
Can't read purple.
|
|
|
Post by Ethan / JRyan on Aug 25, 2018 16:53:20 GMT -5
Hope that helps - trying to differentiate things..
|
|
|
Post by mrbojangles on Aug 26, 2018 9:11:33 GMT -5
I wonder how close MJ#1 is to the source kitchen? With the low permeability of the rock, it seems that hitting the source kitchen may be the quickest way to revenue. But do they know where it is I wonder? If not, would 3D seismic be capable of pinpointing it?
Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
|
|
|
Post by Ethan / JRyan on Aug 26, 2018 13:28:33 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by Ethan / JRyan on Sept 14, 2018 18:11:42 GMT -5
|
|